Rogue specialization

Subtlety Rogue in WoW Forever

Stealth, bleeds and control.

  • Your role: Melee damage
  • Advice for every level to 60
  • Class notes checked

Your character

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Your gear Use my character
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Choose the level you are playing now. The playbook and gear rankings update to match.

Level 60 · Damage in a group

How to play dungeons at level 60

Your combat loop

Press the first one that is ready.

Subtlety’s own loop, from level 10. Before that every Rogue plays the same loop.

Own loop from: Combat level 10Subtlety level 10Assassination level 40

Use Instant Poison on the main hand, Deadly Poison on the off hand, with Rupture before Death Mark. It does 10% more than Instant Poison on the main hand, Deadly Poison on the off hand; 21% more than Instant Poison on both weapons; 11% more than Deadly Poison on the main hand, Instant Poison on the off hand; and 15% more than Deadly Poison on both weapons.

  1. Shank Rank 2 Every 10 sec

    Use it whenever it is ready, every 10 sec.

    1% of your damage
  2. Ghostly Strike Every 20 sec

    Use it whenever it is ready, every 20 sec.

    3% of your damage
  3. Garrote Rank 6 Keep on target · 18 sec

    Keep it on the target; it lasts 18 sec.

    12% of your damage
  4. Slice and Dice Rank 2 Keep up · combo points

    Keep it up with combo points.

    no damage of its own
  5. Rupture Rank 6 Keep up · combo points

    Keep it up with combo points.

    18% of your damage
  6. Death Mark Rank 4 Keep up · combo points

    Keep it up with combo points.

    15% of your damage
  7. Hemorrhage Filler

    Spend the rest of your energy on it.

    7% of your damage
  8. Instant Poison VI Main hand

    Keep it on your main-hand weapon.

    5% of your damage
  9. Deadly Poison V Off hand

    Keep it on your off-hand weapon.

    9% of your damage
  10. Auto attack All the time

    Your weapon swings on its own. Stay in melee range.

    30% of your damage

The first 30 seconds

When to press each one from the pull. The blue line under a press is the global cooldown (1 sec) or cast it holds: nothing else on the global cooldown can go until it ends, so of two that are ready together the higher one goes first.

All the time
Instant Poison VIDeadly Poison VAuto attack

How MaxDPS works this out

Talents at level 60

51 points at level 60: the first at level 10, then one every level.

The MaxDPS build at this level, in the game’s talent frame. Click a talent to learn it and right click to unlearn it, as in the game.

Talents
Unspent Talents
Point order: when each point goes in
  1. Opportunity 5/5 · levels 10–14 +2.6% damage
  2. Improved Ambush 3/3 · levels 15–17 not counted here
  3. Dirty Deeds 2/2 · levels 18–19 +3.9% damage
  4. Serrated Blades 3/3 · levels 20–22 +7.4% damage
  5. Premeditation 1/1 · level 23 not counted here
  6. Initiative 1/3 · level 24 +1.2% damage
  7. Ghostly Strike 1/1 · level 25 +16.5% damage
  8. Elusiveness 2/2 · levels 26–27 not counted here
  9. Camouflage 2/3 · levels 28–29 not counted here
  10. Preparation 1/1 · level 30 not counted here
  11. Heightened Senses 2/2 · levels 31–32 not counted here
  12. Setup 1/3 · level 33 not counted here
  13. Hemorrhage 1/1 · level 34 +4.1% damage
  14. Boot Knife 5/5 · levels 35–39 +16.2% damage
  15. Death Mark 1/1 · level 40 +8.8% damage
  16. Malice 5/5 · levels 41–45 +4.4% damage
  17. Improved Slice and Dice 3/3 · levels 46–48 +5.1% damage
  18. Ruthlessness 3/3 · levels 49–50 and 52 +5.7% damage
  19. Blood Splatter 1/1 · level 51 +7.3% damage
  20. Lethality 2/2 · levels 53–54 +0.3% damage
  21. Vigor 1/2 · level 55 not counted here
  22. Vile Poisons 5/5 · levels 56–60 +2.6% damage

Every Rogue talent

Preliminary item rankings · Dungeons

Subtlety Rogue gear rankings

Opening strikes, Hemorrhage and bleeds · Level 60 · Calculated defaults

Hunt list
Show gear for

Main hand 784 items · Updating…

Where it comes from
Auction prices from

Materials: . Each reagent counts at the lower of a vendor’s price and its lowest buyout.

Key stats show the stats behind the three largest score contributions, as the game tooltip states them; open an item’s details for every value and source.

Main hand items with imported stats, weighted scores and acquisition sources.
Rank Item Score (pts) Where to get it Actions
1 in this filtered list
Persuader Mace · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Crafted · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 45.71 Weapon melee DPS1.0% Hit1.0% Critical strike
120.89
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house Materials about

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 45.71 × 1.8914 = 86.46 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 128 × 0.1464 = 18.74 pts
  • Hit: 10 rating (1.0%) × 1 = 10.00 pts
  • Critical strike: 14 rating (1.0%) × 0.4068 = 5.70 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

2 in this filtered list
Greenhammer Mace · iLvl 65 · Req. 60 · Crafted · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 47.39 Weapon melee DPS1.0% Hit8 Agility
120.80
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house Materials about

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 47.39 × 1.8914 = 89.63 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 109 × 0.1464 = 15.96 pts
  • Hit: 10 rating (1.0%) × 1 = 10.00 pts
  • Agility: 8 × 0.4961 = 3.97 pts
  • Stamina: 12 × 0.1036 = 1.24 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

3 in this filtered list
Ironwood Blade Sword · iLvl 65 · Req. 60 · Crafted · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 47.29 Weapon melee DPS1.0% Hit8 Strength
119.75
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house Materials about

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 47.29 × 1.8914 = 89.44 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 113.5 × 0.1464 = 16.62 pts
  • Hit: 10 rating (1.0%) × 1 = 10.00 pts
  • Strength: 8 × 0.3054 = 2.44 pts
  • Stamina: 12 × 0.1036 = 1.24 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

4 in this filtered list
Hammer of Bestial Fury Mace · iLvl 71 · Req. 60 · Other drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 52.37 Weapon melee DPS13 Strength12 Stamina
119.05
EmerissNPC drop · 13%

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 52.37 × 1.8914 = 99.05 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 99.5 × 0.1464 = 14.57 pts
  • Strength: 13 × 0.3054 = 3.97 pts
  • Stamina: 12 × 0.1036 = 1.24 pts
  • Bonus armor: 90 × 0.0024 = 0.22 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

4 sources

EmerissNPC drop · 13%
LethonNPC drop · 13%
YsondreNPC drop · 10%
TaerarNPC drop · 10%
5 in this filtered list
Ebon Hand Mace · iLvl 70 · Req. 60 · Crafted · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 51.6 Weapon melee DPS9 Stamina
117.41
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house Materials about

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 51.6 × 1.8914 = 97.60 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 129 × 0.1464 = 18.89 pts
  • Stamina: 9 × 0.1036 = 0.93 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

6 in this filtered list
Blackguard Sword · iLvl 70 · Req. 60 · Crafted · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 51.67 Weapon melee DPS12 Stamina
112.59
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house Materials about

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 51.67 × 1.8914 = 97.73 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 93 × 0.1464 = 13.62 pts
  • Stamina: 12 × 0.1036 = 1.24 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

7 in this filtered list
Teebu's Blazing Longsword Sword · iLvl 65 · Req. 60 · Other drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 47.24 Weapon melee DPS
109.41
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 47.24 × 1.8914 = 89.35 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 137 × 0.1464 = 20.06 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

8 sources

Lava ReaverNPC drop · <0.1% · Molten Core
Lava ElementalNPC drop · <0.1% · Molten Core
Lava SurgerNPC drop · <0.1% · Molten Core
8 in this filtered list
Krol Blade Sword · iLvl 56 · Req. 51 · Dungeon drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 40.89 Weapon melee DPS1.0% Critical strike7 Strength
102.45
Scholomance AcolyteNPC drop · <0.1%
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 40.89 × 1.8914 = 77.34 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 114.5 × 0.1464 = 16.76 pts
  • Critical strike: 14 rating (1.0%) × 0.4068 = 5.70 pts
  • Strength: 7 × 0.3054 = 2.14 pts
  • Stamina: 5 × 0.1036 = 0.52 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

7 sources

Scholomance AcolyteNPC drop · <0.1%
Scholomance NeophyteNPC drop · <0.1%
Scholomance OccultistNPC drop · <0.1%
Plague GhoulNPC drop · <0.1%
9 in this filtered list
Dal'Rend's Sacred Charge Sword · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Dungeon drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 41.43 Weapon melee DPS1.0% Critical strike4 Strength
102.26

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.43 × 1.8914 = 78.36 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 116 × 0.1464 = 16.98 pts
  • Critical strike: 14 rating (1.0%) × 0.4068 = 5.70 pts
  • Strength: 4 × 0.3054 = 1.22 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

10 in this filtered list
Frostbite Axe · iLvl 65 · Req. 60 · Vendor · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 42.59 Weapon melee DPS15 Strength
101.97
Grunnda WolfheartVendor · 30g 11s 71c · Alterac Valley

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 42.59 × 1.8914 = 80.55 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 115 × 0.1464 = 16.84 pts
  • Strength: 15 × 0.3054 = 4.58 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

2 sources

Grunnda WolfheartVendor · 30g 11s 71c · Alterac Valley
Jekyll FlandringVendor · 31g 99s 95c · Alterac Mountains
11 in this filtered list
Stormstrike Hammer Mace · iLvl 65 · Req. 60 · Vendor · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 42.59 Weapon melee DPS15 Strength
101.97
Gaelden HammersmithVendor · 32g 11s 37c · Alterac Valley

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 42.59 × 1.8914 = 80.55 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 115 × 0.1464 = 16.84 pts
  • Strength: 15 × 0.3054 = 4.58 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

2 sources

Gaelden HammersmithVendor · 32g 11s 37c · Alterac Valley
Thanthaldis SnowgleamVendor · 32g 11s 37c · Alterac Mountains
12 in this filtered list
Bagh Nakh Fist weapon · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Crafted · Weapon training Key stats: 41.48 Weapon melee DPS13 Agility5 Stamina
101.82
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house Materials about

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.48 × 1.8914 = 78.46 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 112 × 0.1464 = 16.40 pts
  • Agility: 13 × 0.4961 = 6.45 pts
  • Stamina: 5 × 0.1036 = 0.52 pts

Rare · Weapon training — check item requirements

Source

13 in this filtered list
Cinderedge Crescent Axe · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Other drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 41.25 Weapon melee DPS14 Attack power0.5% Critical strike
100.67
CinderNPC drop · 29%

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.25 × 1.8914 = 78.02 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 99 × 0.1464 = 14.49 pts
  • Attack power: 14 × 0.3054 = 4.28 pts
  • Critical strike: 7 rating (0.5%) × 0.4068 = 2.85 pts
  • Stamina: 10 × 0.1036 = 1.04 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

CinderNPC drop · 29%
14 in this filtered list
Darkspear Skirmisher's Bludgeon Mace · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Vendor · Weapon training for some races, Reputation required Key stats: 41.43 Weapon melee DPS11 Attack power13 Stamina
100.05
Creeg BothunkVendor · 29g 7s 5c · The Barrens

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.43 × 1.8914 = 78.36 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 116 × 0.1464 = 16.98 pts
  • Attack power: 11 × 0.3054 = 3.36 pts
  • Stamina: 13 × 0.1036 = 1.35 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races · Reputation required — check item requirements

Source

Creeg BothunkVendor · 29g 7s 5c · The Barrens
15 in this filtered list
Guerrilla's Jagged Mace Mace · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Vendor · Weapon training for some races, Reputation required Key stats: 41.43 Weapon melee DPS10 Attack power13 Stamina
99.74
Bryanna EmbreezeVendor · 28g 86s 90c · The Barrens

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.43 × 1.8914 = 78.36 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 116 × 0.1464 = 16.98 pts
  • Attack power: 10 × 0.3054 = 3.05 pts
  • Stamina: 13 × 0.1036 = 1.35 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races · Reputation required — check item requirements

Source

Bryanna EmbreezeVendor · 28g 86s 90c · The Barrens
16 in this filtered list
Legionnaire's Sword Sword · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Vendor · Horde only · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 41.48 Weapon melee DPS13 Strength5 Stamina
99.34
Kelm HargunthVendor · 25g 84s 57c · The Barrens

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.48 × 1.8914 = 78.46 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 112 × 0.1464 = 16.40 pts
  • Strength: 13 × 0.3054 = 3.97 pts
  • Stamina: 5 × 0.1036 = 0.52 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

Kelm HargunthVendor · 25g 84s 57c · The Barrens
17 in this filtered list
Protector's Sword Sword · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Vendor · Alliance only · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 41.48 Weapon melee DPS13 Strength5 Stamina
99.34
Illiyana MoonblazeVendor · 21g 96s 89c · Ashenvale

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 41.48 × 1.8914 = 78.46 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 112 × 0.1464 = 16.40 pts
  • Strength: 13 × 0.3054 = 3.97 pts
  • Stamina: 5 × 0.1036 = 0.52 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

Illiyana MoonblazeVendor · 21g 96s 89c · Ashenvale
18 in this filtered list
Mass of McGowan Mace · iLvl 62 · Req. 57 · Other drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 40.89 Weapon melee DPS10 Strength10 Stamina
98.19
EmerissNPC drop · 5.1%
Alliance: Horde: None on the auction house

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 40.89 × 1.8914 = 77.34 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 114.5 × 0.1464 = 16.76 pts
  • Strength: 10 × 0.3054 = 3.05 pts
  • Stamina: 10 × 0.1036 = 1.04 pts

Rare · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

92 sources

EmerissNPC drop · 5.1%
Lord KazzakNPC drop · 4.4% · Blasted Lands
AzuregosNPC drop · 3%
LethonNPC drop · 2.9%
Skarr the UnbreakableBoss drop · 2.8% · Feralas
TaerarNPC drop · 2.7%
NefarianNPC drop · 2.6% · Blackwing Lair
OnyxiaNPC drop · 2.6%
RagnarosBoss drop · 1.7% · Molten Core
YsondreNPC drop · 1.2%
All 92 sources
19 in this filtered list
Ironfoe Mace · iLvl 60 · Req. 55 · Dungeon drop · Weapon training for some races Key stats: 43.54 Weapon melee DPS
97.65

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 43.54 × 1.8914 = 82.35 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 104.5 × 0.1464 = 15.30 pts

Epic · Weapon training for some races — check item requirements

Source

20 in this filtered list
Felstriker Dagger · iLvl 63 · Req. 58 · Dungeon drop Key stats: 45.59 Weapon melee DPS
97.57

Score breakdown

  • Weapon melee DPS: 45.59 × 1.8914 = 86.23 pts
  • Weapon damage per swing: 77.5 × 0.1464 = 11.35 pts

Epic

Source

Item stats from the WoW Forever game files; sources from data collected from the live game. Auction prices are the lowest buyout on the Americas · Normal auction houses, read from Blizzard every hour; pick another region or ruleset under Filters. Which house is which ruleset is matched by size and still being confirmed in game.

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